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my daughter now truly believes eating animals is very wrong and totally not meant to be (after my indoctrination ofcors, so? not sure,,),

she says it in school to the kids (and they are telling her other bullsh*t, today a kid told her she would die more soon if she wasnt eating meat...)

she dedicated herself to not eat animals anymore, i feel so proud of her!!

it's obviously not her fault that the world makes an animal look (and taste) like food .......

before she was just overwhelmed by the "good" taste of it i guess.

(my mother, who she loves to be with very much, is still giving her animals to eat...)

she's so smart though , cause when i told her a week ago, she was like: he but animals do eat animals?

a cat kills a mouse, a panter kills a deer etc.

didnt really know what to say to her about this???

cause that is soo right.

some people talk about animals have feelings too, but they kill other animals, right?

that is just their nature!

trying to tell her it is not our nature to do so (is that really so?? still not sure about it,,)

anyway, i'm so happy she feels that way now (she said she would start with this, and afterwards go to to no dairy eating anymore...)

i always had double feelings to talk to her like this all the time , forbid things is not the way, but i also didnt want to make her feel guilty about eating (horrible thing to feel), but i actually was doing that all the time when i found out she ate meat..

not easy,

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about the animals eating animals thing: 

i say that if the only animals that were eaten were animals caught from the wild by humans for their own consumption, with their bare hands or tools that they personally crafted, i would have a lot less problems with it, because i think that a lot of people would conclude that's just too gruesome for them to stomach when there are lots of plant-based foods around to eat. nobody in my family could be troubled to eat meat under those circumstances for sure. 

I've brought up the subject a couple of times with my daughter (now 7) and she has not responded well, so I've dropped it. Everyone she knows and loves eats animals and so does she herself, and it becomes much more of a challenge in such an environment to see meat-eating for what it is. I believe children and adults alike will find it more difficult to consume animals if they have connected with real, live animals; they can "feel" the animals more. Therefore spending time with animals will probably help.

 

I personally believe in gently increasing awareness, to a degree that the child feels comfortable with, and not only in matters of diet. Giving young children nightmares with Earthlings is not something I personally believe in. Unless I misremember, in Waldorf (Steiner) pedagogy there is an idea of child development where they have one phase during which they come to understand and believe that life is beautiful and safe. Only once this phase is finished are they ready to learn of the evils in the world. While I'm not a full supporter of Steiner pedagogy, I think there's something to this - a foundation of love and peace from which the child can at a pace of her own choosing explore the things in our society that are not quite as we'd wish.

 

As for animals killing animals, it might help to explain that is what they have evolved to eat in their environment. Dolphins for instance would die if they could not eat fish. Our human evolution appears not to have been of such a character. Even though our distant ancestors definitely did eat animals, the tribal kind of hunting, as Cynthia says, is a very different matter from our modern consumption of animal foods.

 

I write a bit about our emotional distance scale here. The closer you can bring animals on her EDS, the less likely she is to view them as food and the more likely she is to connect with them and love them. The same is true of humans, trees, plants... of life itself. Not a single one of us would consider eating a fellow human... because they're too close to us on our EDS.

When I attempted to make our house vegan dairy was the main issue (meat was never a big part of our life). So I focused on the fact that the calves are taken away from their mommies. My kids are all mama's boys so that really got them. This avoided the whole killing issue but you will have to decide whether your kids are ready to lose a piece of their innocence. It never occured to my kids that a baby could me separated from its mother. How wonderful it would have been to have raised them vegan from the beginning and held the sad truth from them a little longer.

I think that's what would get my son too if he ever wanted to try dairy.  He still breastfeeds so I think its hard for him to wrap his head around the fact that some people drink cow milk when they could be having human milk!

and jack, unfortunately, freelee deleted my profile on 30bad, so i cant log in there anymore

Dearest me! For any particular reason?

As she did with mine.... ; )

i guess we're not the only ones...  only, as in society, people are afraid to speak up against "popular" people...  and (also as in society, or better said, worse!) those who are not "in the line" with what the (popular) leader thinks, are just ignored or (in our case) erased....

ya man, my wish, dear god, is to find  true people, friends, to share this lifestyle with. as till now, didnt find those...

xxx

Ah so you spoke up, I see. There will be a fruit festival in southern Spain in September, that could be a good spot to connect.

I have been reading a bookcalled Empathic Civilization - it talks about the Biophilia hypothesis- that we have an instinctive bond with other living organisms/animals etc.  It also talks about other animals showing empathy to other animals e.g. a elephant saw a baby rhino stuck in mud and tried to help it out etc.  Although animals eat animals and although we may be designed to eat animals I think its important that we live by our design and part of that design is our empathy.  That seems to be the design of nature and most living things.  Killing is a necessity for some animals.

Whenever I see a tribe hunt they seem to do it respectfully (or rather that's the impression I get particularly when you compare slaughterhouses) - I guess when you are faced with killing something, then using it for nourishment it is entirely different to it being served up on a plate and I would probably emphasise this. 

My 4 year old has asked what certain things are in the shop but when he finds out its cow milk or pig or any other animal he doesn't like the idea of it.  Just as if he wants to try others food we always make him aware of whats in it and offer to find him an alternative without those items in which makes him happy.

If he wants to eat meat I would prefer making him part of the whole process including hunting than just get him something from a supermarket (which I would never do anyway I would have to find a better source).  Of course though I wouldn't force him to do anything he didn't want to do but would explain why I think its important etc.

I´m so happy I´m raising my kids vegan from the beginning (well my oldest was 1,5 when we went vegan so he doesn´t remember anything else).

They also point at meat at the store and ask what it is, I just tell them the truth "it´s a dead chicken" and they were super interested the first time I told them (they don´t really know what dead means they are 2 and 3)  and they always ask to see the chicken at the store now just to say how gross it is and say they dont want to eat it because it´s dead. Also, if they don´t want to eat something they often say "this is chicken" to try to get away from eating it. (of course it never is chicken, just an excuse).

It´s so cute to go grocery shopping with them and if they want to buy something they first ask me if it´s organic and vegan.

smile, that is so funny that they call it chicken when they don't want to eat it...

my daughter just came back from a week, skiholiday, with my mother and sisters. i gave lots of alternatives to take but she told me with an enormous guilt face that she had eaten some chicken and, per accident, some ham.. i told her it's fine and that she will learn it in the future. i dont want her feeling guilty eating .i feel i contributed allready too much to that..

everyone , also thanks for replying!

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